Talk:Songs

Some conventions

Just to clarify some of the conventions I have been following here:

1. I avoid using curly quotes (“ ” and ‘ ’) and curly apostrophes (’) in favor of the straight versions (" and '). (This is a site-wide convention, actually. Curly punctuation is only used as necessary to match the titles of external sources, like articles, YouTube videos, etc.)
2. I only include the name of the original artist after a song title [e.g., "(Adele song)"] if there are multiple songs under the same title listed at Wikipedia (or should be). Such disambiguators are only used in link targets [e.g., "All of Me (John Legend song)"] if Angelina has actually sung multiple different songs with the same title.
3. Other disambiguators used by Wikipedia in their article titles [e.g., "(song)"] are given in <!-- HTML comments -->, to potentially aid in the creation of articles for those songs (since such articles always link to the relevant Wikipedia artices).

- dcljr (talk) 12:12, 25 March 2024 (UTC)

Regarding

1. Ok, I'll try to follow that.

I was wondering if there is a threshold of what you want to include here? I added the Modern Talking stuff as it seemed to be in the same category as what you added before that. But then there is stuff like the latest two additions on the "H S" channel, were she is mostly singing along, her voice is hardly discernable (she might just be lip-syncing), and it's really short. I don't cover those in my playlists so far.

- Most2dot0 (talk) 14:17, 28 March 2024 (UTC)

Historically, I have included some things where she is seen singing but not heard (for example, "There Was a Princess Long Ago" and "Hurra for deg"). However, if it is apparent that she is only mouthing the words, then I wouldn't include it (and that includes her "traditional-style" TikToks, where the lip-syncing is the whole point of the video). Of course, it's gonna be a judgment call sometimes. (BTW, sorry I haven't been checking for questions like this more often. I'll try to address the questions you've already asked elsewhere sometime "soon".) - dcljr (talk) 06:49, 9 April 2024 (UTC)

Regarding

2.: that as an complexity that causes issues with the songs data tables, as it some things that my change over time (like when Angelina did the 2nd Crazy song). In the Data:SongsToVideos.json I define the "title" and "disambiguation" fields, and the idea leave the title pur, and put the "xxx song" designation to the disambiguation. I then automatically construct the link to the related songs page, but that will point in many cases to "Title (OriginalArtist song)" whereas it is just "Title", as Angelina sang only one version. Now, I could solve this by some annotation, like that it only gets appened if the disamiguation starts with a "+" character. Then there are the special versions for "Crazy", where for the Willie Nelson/Patsy Cline song you even have a different attribution in the songe page title than in the song lists display. That could e.g. be worked around, by mentioning Patsy Cline in the comment (once that gets displayed). ~ Most2dot0 (talk) 17:15, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

Regarding

3.: I could put these also in the comments, though I doubt many people would find them there if the get not printed. ~ Most2dot0 (talk) 17:15, 3 August 2024 (UTC)

"Home" twice

I decided to leave it at "Home" for Angelina's version of the song, as in this Wiki the general rule is that everything is about her, unless otherwise noted. --Most2dot0 (talk) 22:04, 11 September 2025 (UTC)

Good instinct… but arguably by that logic that title would seem to belong to an article about Angelina's home. (!?) I dunno… I'm also reconsidering my choice of Oslo for the song and Oslo, Norway for the city. Perhaps we should go ahead and use Oslo (song) and just Oslo for the city, and Home (Angelina Jordan song) for Angelina's song [since Home (song) would not be sufficiently disambiguating]? Or maybe Home (original song) (maintaining the theme of everything's about Angelina). Hmm… - dcljr (talk) 03:41, 12 September 2025 (UTC)

Beyond The Dream

The "the" in "Beyond The Dream" is written with a starting capital letter on the album, as opposed to the "for" in "Falling for You". I initially put it in here in lower case, too, but now made the mistake to have it in upper case in the Performances.json-devel. However, do you want to follow the apparent spelling mistake on the album anyway? It's in there on all platforms it seams. --Most2dot0 (talk) 22:14, 11 September 2025 (UTC)

I am willing to assume that both are "non-significant" deviations from the normal naming conventions (i.e., that the capitalized "The" and "For" don't have any special meaning), but we can just go with what's seen in the current sources (and redirect the standard title case forms to the nonstandard ones) until we have evidence that the capitalization is, indeed, not significant. It really doesn't make much difference until we have actual articles for the songs, anyway. [grin] - dcljr (talk) 03:53, 12 September 2025 (UTC)

Replace with list of data from database

@Dcljr: I think we are close to replace this manual song list with one generated from the Cargo database. Here are some points I would like you to be aware of/consider:
1. I think the additonal remarks and references are not required, as having them in the song article, for example in "note" field, is sufficient. If you want to keep some, I'd recommend to introduce a new field like "info" for really short notes that would appear here.
2. "Back to Black" is here taged with a star (★), but it is not marked as an orignial in the database. My proposal is to leave it without the star, since Angelina nowadays sings it with original lyrics. As an alternative, we could put it into the "disambiguation" field, then it would show up as "Back to Black (★)", with only the "Back to Black" in bold. Or this would be an occasion, were such an "info" field could put to use, if we want to have it.
3. I thik the sentences why a song is included here (Rusty's list, etc.) is obsolete, as the references are in the song articles.
4. The note about starting articles should be adopted to what's to be done to add a song to the list, i.e. creating an article stub. Possibly offer an easier way, like to comment in a section of the discussion page?
5. I would propose to integrate the replacement for this with the performances listing "Songs by title". I was sucessful in recreating my usual table format with Cargo queries, have a look here to get the idea (note, that the inner table/performances listings have not yet the final form): Template:SongsTable-devel. If you prefer it, I think it would be possible to also recreate the list format used here.
6. Note, that the numbering is not achievable with Cargo queries based tables, but I might be able to use the "#" numbering when creating a list based format. However, I think the numbering is misleading anyhow, as its not fixed and wil change if songs are added before existing entries. I assume its purpose was to determine the total count, and that could be achieved otherwise.
7. The Cargo "Songs" table now contains entries of types original/cover/redirect, and "section headers" (type=""). I guess you are not happy about the latter (two?), but this makes it much easier to generate the A-Z anchors in the table. Otherwise we'd have to call a seperate sub-query for each letter.
--Most2dot0 (talk) 12:48, 3 November 2025 (UTC)